The whole point of free speech is not to make ideas exempt from criticism but to expose them to it.

Thursday, October 8, 2009

Can anyone translate this comment by Bob Ellis that appeared in the thread following "Anyone can end up in jail," below? Try as I might, all I can make of it is, "Oink, oink, oink, oink...."

Michael, I'm familiar with the courage and accomplishemnts of MLKJr and Ghandi. Bob Newland is no Ghandi or Martin Luther King.

They fought to see all human beings treated equally and fairly.

Newland fights for the right to get stoned, and to sell dope to other people so they can get stoned.

If you're eager to embrace and defend the lowest common denominator, you should try the Democrat Party. That lines up well with their philosophy but really doesn't fit in with the GOP.

More importantly, do us all a favor and stop demeaning the courage of people like Martin Luther King by comparing Newland's lawlessness and thirst for intoxication to their struggle.

I suppose people who have nothing greater to contribute to society than getting high feel they need to manufacture some nobility for their lives (it's easier than working for real noble goals), but the two aren't even close.


Michael Sanborn said...

His earlier comment was in response to a post by Anonymous, not me. I didn't understand it then, and still don't.

I didn't compare Bob to Gandhi or Mandela or Martin Luther King. I like Bob. But, he's no Gandhi.

He is not allowed, under court order, to discuss what he was fighting for. People who have loved ones who have received pain relief from what he was fighting for understand.

One need never expect Bob Ellis to have compassion for people who are suffering and could be relieved by using a natural product.

Bill Fleming said...

Ellis is delusional, Mike.

That's like when you hallucinate, become hysterical, and babble on and on after an overdose, only without taking drugs.

Problem is, drugs wear off. Ellis, on the other hand, needs to be deprogrammed. It's rough going. We should maybe pray for him.

Bill Fleming said...

By the way, tell Bob E. that the proper spelling is "Gandhi" as in Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi.

And Gandhi might have argued with you about Bob N. "being no Gandhi," Mike.

He was, after all, a Hindu, who saw the Divine in all of us.


Donna said...

Oh Oh OH !!! Can we make him live in a one bedroom apartment, on welfare, with five neglected children because the mother was forced to carry out her pregnancy ?

We could factor in a mother with cancer, undergoing chemo, in so much pain that death would be a blessing. Everything that would ease her pain adequately is illegal.

Or perhaps a jail cell. Apparently he looked away from the road for one split second and crashed head on into a another car killing someone. Manslaughter.

I sincerely don't think I have ever run across a "Christian" with so little compassion.

Bill Fleming said...

"I like your Christ, but I don't like your Christians.
They are so unlike your Christ."
— Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi

Bob Ellis said...

You guys are quite a crew! I feel like I walked into a nut house, only to hear the inmates calling me crazy.

I tried to keep the syllables down, but I apologize for still leaving you scratching your heads. I can only dumb-down my conversation so much. That's probably why liberals never seem to understand anything I another average American has to say. (Maybe it's the pot fumes)

For instance, how laughably transparent the "medical marijuana" scam is. It's interesting that most of the people pushing for "medical marijuana" just co-incidentally are also pushing for general legalization. Just pure coincidence, I'm sure.

Just as it also seems pure coincidence that while our medical community is filled to the gills with pain medication, only marijuana will do the trick. And so what if THC is available in other forms than in Cheech and Chong form; that's just not good enough.

We also have a gal here who thinks people just fall into " a one bedroom apartment, on welfare, with five neglected children because the mother was forced to carry out her pregnancy." It couldn't possibly have anything to do with a poor work ethic, sexual irresponsibility, poor judgment, or anything remotely like her own fault. No, I'm sure it was some greedy capitalist who chose her randomly to target for imprisonment in misery. You're inability to come even remotely near individual responsibility or expecting it of anyone else is shameful.

You mistake gullibility and moral cowardice for "compassion." Perhaps you simply don't know any better, since the dominant theme in our society is to live in fear of being called "uncompassionate", to run from any form of moral certainty, and mindlessly applaud someone for their behavior no matter how harmful it is to them or to long as that behavior doesn't fall under what liberals call "intolerance." "Intolerance" is not to be tolerated for a moment!

Just as Newland shouldn’t be confused with a MLKJr or Gandhi :-), you shouldn't confuse moral cowardice for "compassion," either.

I really hope someday you can all wake up and grow up, but I'm not holding my breath. In the meantime, the rest of us will be working to maintain a health, law-abiding civilization for you.

Bill Fleming said...

Aw, go ahead, Bob.

Bring out the big words.

We can take it.

For example, I don't really think you're "crazy."

That's just dumbed down talk for "Delusional (Paranoid), Grandiose Type," and "Narcissistic Personality Disorder," symptoms of which you present practically every time you write something.

Of course, it could be that you just write during the manic phases of your bipolar disorder. You'd have to see a psychoanalyst for a real diagnosis. For sure, don't take my word for it.

But in the meantime Bob, don't worry.

Whatever it is, I hear they have good meds for it.

Anonymous said...


Wasn't it you who called Christians atheists? I mean if you want to talk about delusions. Were you taking meds then?

Neal said...

Why I'm moved to respond to Ellis is beyond me, but this is more for the record, not for him.

First, his "scam" argument. The fact that most people who support medical marijuana also support general marijuana legalization has no bearing whatsoever on the question of whether or not marijuana has medical, therapeutic value. It does. That's a fact, and the fact is undisputed.

Second, his "only marijuana" argument is a red herring. No one is saying that only marijuana will relieve their ailments. They are merely saying that marijuana relieves those ailments better than anything else. This too is a fact, and it is undisputed.

So we have a natural substance that has therapeutic value which exceeds the thereaputic value of (and has fewer undesirable side effects than) other, less natural and more expensive substances.

What exactly is the justification for depriving this substance, by force of law, from legitimately sick people?

Bob, I assure you I can handle the biggest words and most sophisticated arguments you can muster. Bring it. I'll fucking fillet you.

Neal said...

Or perhaps I'll just rely on the only authority Bob Ellis will ever recognize:

"And God said, Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth: and it was so. And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good." -- Genesis 1:11-12

And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which is upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat. -- Genesis 1:29

Bill Fleming said...

Anon, I challenge you to show me how what I'm saying is in any way sense delusional.

My observation is that most people, including Christians, are athiests to all gods but their own.

That's pretty cut and dried isn't it?

Do you dispute it?

If so, then how many Gods YOU believe in?

Bob Newland said...

There is some moral certainty, Ellis. And you're on the wrong side of it. You're an ignorant, pusillanimous, immoral coward. You know I can't contradict you (under pain of a court order) so you throw out statements you know to be lies, hoping I will take your bait and subject myself to further punishment. What a disgusting piece of hog excrement you are.

Bob Newland said...

Oh, and you're pretty synonymous with Stan Adelstein, too.

Ted Galvanzki said...

Bill had it right, Ellis comes across as narcissistic. I’m embarrassed to say we come from the same political party. I find most “Drug Warriors” narcissistic. Ellis, you’re one of those Republicans that give us all a bad name. Most Republicans I know do not support our wacky “war on weed”. I’ve lost two loved ones to your war on weed, which was enough for me.

Considering marijuana is less harmful then aspirin and much safer then alcohol, it seems too much has been made out of something that is truly, no big deal.

How many lives have to be destroyed over it? If it were regulated, kids would get carded trying to purchase it. The way it works now they go to the corner street thug / gang banger, whom doesn’t card and offers worse things than marijuana. The Coors and Budweiser guys don’t sell beer on the street corners anymore; they also quit shooting at each other.

Steve Sibson said...


Atheists believe there is "NO" god.

Pantheists believe there are "many" gods.

Christian believe there is "one" true God.

Bill Fleming said...

Not exactly Sibby. Jewish people argue that there is only one true God manifestation, and so do Muslims. So do a lot of Native Americans. Christians argue that a in addition to the above spiritual manifestation a human being (Jesus) was/is god as well via a third transmittal entity (the Holy Spirit). A pantheist argues that everything is God, i.e. that nature and God are synonymous and that there is no supernatural. These are all very broad generalizations of course, as are your propositions, but mine, I believe, are more accurate.

Steve Sibson said...

So Jews, Muslims, and Indaians are atheists too?

And there are many types of pantheistic belief systems as is monotheistic. Your pantheistic definition is atheist as God is the Supernatural.

But the truth is that atheists believe there is no god. Christians belief in the one true God. They are not the same.

Bill Fleming said...

Exactly. As I said, every one is an atheist to every God but their own. I think you're starting to get it, Steve.

Steve Sibson said...

No Bill, you are still delusional.

What are you smoking?

Bill Fleming said...

What do you mean by "supernatural" exactly, Steve?

I submit that we don't even begin to understand what the words "nature" and "natural" mean, and would do well to work on mastering the things that can be known before we start trying to understand the things that can't.

Just a suggestion.